On a whimsical note here is an extract from today’s First Capital Connect board:
“18:32 Sevenoaks to Kentish Town due 19:50
This train is running on time.This is due to an earlier broken down train.”

- Shows the next 3 trains, with their ETA
- Shows where said trains are on the network (i.e. “Just left Edgware Road”)

9 times out of 10, the information on the app is better than the information on the platform boards, particularly in the case of the subsurface lines (District, H&C, Circle etc.), which is fortunate, because those are the only platforms on which it’ll work!

I was having this very discussion the other day (“they must know where their stock is”) and we came to roughly the same assertion as you made at the start of your post.

I agree with the comments above – they must have it, but getting them to relinquish it is where the rub lies, I think. Various concerns from security to PR will undoubtedly be brought to bear, e.g. if TfL ever actually define what they mean by a “good” service, using this API, one could easily set up a system to determine what percentage of their trains meet this obligation – I know I’d strongly consider crafting it. Perhaps a decent UI could be strapped on it to the point where TfL could be convinced to “outsource” their data interpretation to the community…? An infinite number of coders and all that.

I suppose it’s the traditional issue of opening something up increases the number of eyes on it, and whether those releasing the data are comfortable (both competitively and culturally) with having such a large number of eyes on their internal information. Bloody-minded persistence, as you mention above, may be the way forward.

I’m optimistic – the Tube Board app shows that someone, somehow, has managed to tap into this info, so that’s a foot in the door. I’m passionate about giving people the information they need when they need it, and the information doled out about public transport has ample room for improvement and interesting uses.

I’m wondering exactly what technology is currently used to track them. GPS? RFID?

I would be interested to know if the current “Train Due in x Minutes” is triggered by an exact knowledge of its physical location, an estimate based on an automated trigger set off when arriving/departing at the previous station, or if this info has to be manually “radioed” in by the driver.

But I agree, Paul – they *must* know where their trains are. It’s a case of convincing them to relinquish the data. Especially if they see potential revenue in it…

My personal beef is with the lack of information about where tube trains are. Take the Hammersmith and City line. If you want to take this from Liverpool street or Kings Cross to the west of London you can be standing on the platform for up to 45 minutes without any information about when the next train will arrive. Meanwhile, fairly accurate information about the Circle line will be displayed. Occasionally a H&C train will flicker on the board, but the arrival time is wrong 9 times out of ten, and often the train will mysteriously vanish from the board. Having real time information about the position and movements of the nearest train would do a lot to assuage passenger frustration and to aid planning (should I nip over to the Central line instead?) Of course, underground, mobile phone apps are not so useful, but if real time information exists for tube trains (and I assume *someone* knows where they are) there must be ways of transmitting this to the platform (and I don’t mean over the tannoy, which can seldom be heard over the din). How about making those wonderful tube maps on every platform more *alive*, by showing each train as a moving light? That’d be a lovely Xmas present for next year. (dream on, methinks)

I’ve left my email and i’ll keep watching to see what needs to be done next!

Perhaps they could think about porting this more widely, making it bullet proof for accuracy and then adding some nice to haves in due course. But I am not convinced they need to start from scratch….so don’t let them off the hook!

Several feeds needed to build a proper train information system:

planned schedules

route status (eg Birmingham-Manchester running fine, delays expected)

real-time location of individual services

station information and status (eg station has disabled access, everything running fine, escalators out of action)

passenger levels (eg normal peak hour crush, crowded)

planned events (eg football game scheduled for 3pm – heavy crowds expected all afternoon)

Would say the first four are needed, last couple nice-to-haves.